License Plate Lawsuit Brings More Arguing
Saturday July 5, 2008
Here's a follow-up to last month's post on the South Carolina "I Believe" lawsuit. The Columbia Free Times says that the plaintiffs in the suit have been on the receiving end of some especially nasty mail. Reverend Neal Jones of the Unitarian Universalist Fellowship of Columbia is one of several plaintiffs in the suit filed by Americans United for Church and State, and told the Free Times that "since the lawsuit was filed, [letters have been received] saying “go to hell” and accusing the group’s director of being the antichrist". Jones says that by filing the suit, he and the plaintiffs aren't trying to prevent Christians from voicing their opinions in South Carolina. Instead, they've filed the suit because they believe "the government should stay neutral because by pushing an issue like this, it seems like religious bullying".
Comments
The government needs to stay neutral.
I know this fits in with the comment I left on the post about the MacPebbles, but it seems like Christians always like to think that they’re being persecuted when something doesn’t go their way. *shakes head*
The government has no buisness in religion, it should remain neutral in cases such as this. It is not the place of government to interfere with religion.
The far right had to choose the slogan “I Believe” for the license plate because “self-righteous, judgemental hypocrites who spout hatred” wouldn’t fit.
That was just a bit of a bash there. Why, when we are fighting for equality in the religious arena, do we sit and slam other’s religious beliefs. That just set us all back to the age of the celts where persecution was rampant. Thank you Celtic Joie (very sarcastically said).
The government needs to *become* neutral- it’s getting there, but isn’t quite yet. We’ve got the pledge of alliegance still including God, politicians speaking at churches, our president asking us to pray, etc. But in the bigger scope of things, I think we’re nearly there, maybe.
As for the hate mail, saying ‘go to hell,’ as an ex-Christian I know this wouldn’t be a Christian sentiment. No Christian would really want someone else to go to hell, they’d want to save them. It’s kindof like those guys who shot people at abortion clinics in the name of Jesus. It just doesn’t make sense with their religion. “God is love” right? (Just to clarify, I’m now an animist witch, no longer Christian.)
I got a lot of slack in school for not standing up for or saying the pledge, enough to where one kid apparently wanted to punch me for it. I would’ve stood up for it if there wasn’t any God in it. The government can’t be biased towards one religion or another, mine or yours, and it feels like they’re not keeping up that end of the bargain.
On the license plates, if any church in SC had put up the money for the plates and had their names on them, more power to them. But this is clearly a case of the government of SC showing favoritism to one religion, unconstitutional and unethical. It wouldn’t have even been right if it they had made one for every religion, it would have still breached the church and state borderline.
If I had to choose between favoritism for all and favoritism for one, I’d go for none. Then, its absolutely fair, and the government would be doing its job instead of finding new ways to attempt to get around it and fail, hence the lawsuit.
I live in Columbia, SC and I know Rev. Jones. I am the facilitator of the CUUPs (Covenant of Unitarian Universalist Pagans) group based out of the UU Fellowship that he is Pastor of. There are many things to be said about this plate issue. I believe that it would be better to have symbols available to people of all faiths so they can proudly declare what they believe in.
Shannon Carder
[letters have been received] saying “go to hell” and accusing the group’s director of being the antichrist”.
Wow, Christians full of rage and hate. That is exactly how to love your neighbor as you love yourself. I was watching a comentary the other day, the main basis was that “These Christain groups have lost their minds! I want Jesus to come back and say, ‘That’s not what I meant!” Somedays, I think that some of the christians are so fearful that the devil is going to get them, and other people are going to sweeped into evil that they don’t see it in themselves that what they are doing is so against the basic teaching of Jesus. Love your neighbor as you love yourself. Treat others the way you would want to be treated.
I don’t know why everyone is so surprised by the appalling way some Christians act. Back in the day when I considered myself one of them I was ashamed of the way some people acted. In fact when someone started telling me what a “Good Christian” they were, it was a signal to avoid them as much as possible. My experience is, the better Christian they think they are, the less humane they act.
I guess we all just need to be thankful we dont live in Iran; they shoot decenters there!
Religious fanatics of any religion (including pagan) are dangerous people because they tend to think that they and only they are right and that everyone else is wrong!
Then they fear those who don’t agree with them and then their fear turns to hate… so we IS the love?
As long as all religion’s symbols (and good luck with that!) are available to be represented on the “I Believe” license plate I see no conflict of the non-establishment clause of the First Amendment, as the government does not purchase these plates, the individual vehicle owner does. (I’m assuming this will be in the nature of a “vanity plate”?)
It seems insensitive of Atheism, but it also can be said that Atheists believe there is no God, therefore if a symbol of Atheism was available, their views would also be represented by the statement, “I Believe.”
For those who prefer not to signal their personal beliefs “on their sleeves”, so to speak, perhaps an “I Believe” license plate with as many representative symbols as could fit would serve? As a polytheist myself, I’d actually like something like this!
We Neopagans have to stop attacking religion and start simply showing up as “believers,” ourselves. I have no problem with unobtrusive religious practice or representation; I simply want my views represented alongside everyone else’s. We can be NON-Christian without being ANTI-Christian, after all.
Note to Gaia: The original Pledge of Allegiance didn’t have “under God” in it, that was added later on. You can always say the Pledge and leave that bit out, or quietly say “mumble, mumble” to keep the rhythmn , or even invent your own phrase for that section that would sound similar: “under-planned”, “understand”, “Wonderland”, etc. I believe that not standing is discourteous, however; if you watch the Olympics, I believe you’ll see everyone stand during each nation’s anthems, though they may not cover their hearts or salute, just to show courtesy and respect for others.
Threefold Blessings,
~ Fi’rinne Dairinn (Shazza)
Grove Organizer
Green Timbre Protogrove, ADF
Joshua Tree, CA
I agree with the notion of the “I belive” licence plate being availiable to people of ALL Paths- not ONLY Christians, that would be fair.
Can we please stop lumping groups of people into narrow minded little slots??? There are just as many graduations/shadings/flavors of christians as there are of ANY other group! Including the pagans!
I have experienced those dark, troubled, souls who are full of hate, etc…. across all religious paths. And, I have come upon truely unhinged, debauched, souls within the ‘pagan’ path, too. If you are naive enough to walk around out here thinking pagans are all sweet, nice, fluffy, wouldn’t hurt a flea types?? You are going to be sweet meat for some sharp toothed predator!!
A friend of mine put it very well… he said he believed in Jesus. But some of the ‘fan club’ troubled him. Yes, I often fantasize about WWJD if he did walk about today and experience that fan club in action. I figure he might be pretty darned disgusted.
Across time great men and women have taught us that meeting injustice, intolerence, hatred, closedmindedness with ANYTHING other than true LOVE just makes things worse. This is an underlying thread of spirit that should prove to us all that we are ONE within the spirit realm.
I truely hope I never come across as ‘anti’ any religion, to a point. That point being- any group that incites violence against another? I am not supporting!
This is to insanityrains- that age of Celtic persecutions is news to me! Care to give some historical background? I know lots of documentation about Celts being on recieving end of persecutions, but none that they perpetuated upon others.
Donna
Celtic to the core!
If the people of SC truly want to express their belief on their license plates, fine. Why does a symbol have to accompany an expression of “I believe”? Just have the plate simply read “I believe”, then it will be suitable to everyone. Everyone believes in something: their God(ess), their country, $$, Science, whatever. “I believe” that would end the controversy completely. What do you believe in?
Why don’t the license plates say “I believe in _________.” and let people fill it in with a sharpie marker?